THANKS TO MJJF - MJJF - RIJO JACKSON, Notes/testimony here!

Wednesday, May 18, 2005 – The parade of witnesses supporting the Michael Jackson defense continued Wednesday. Almost all the defense witnesses have directly contradicted testimony from prosecution witnesses earlier in the trial. Many of the prosecution’s witnesses have been criticized for bearing a grudge against Jackson and discrediting their accounts is vital to Jackson’s defense. The singer’s young cousin, Simone Jackson, resumed her testimony from Tuesday when she told jurors she had witnessed Jackson’s accuser, Gavin Arvizo, and his brother Star stealing wine from the kitchen. She said she had spoken with the boys that day but not to their mother, Janet. Beginning his cross-examination, prosecutor Ron Zonen established that Simone had not known anything about the Arvizo family before arriving at Neverland for a party in February 2003. She confirmed that this was the only time she had seen the Arvizos during that month. Zonen questioned whether Simone had wondered why the Arvizo boys were not in school. Simone said she had wondered but had not questioned it. MR. ZONEN: All right. Now, at some point in time, you saw these kids take wine from the kitchen; is that right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. And Mr. Mesereau called it stealing wine. Did you think they were stealing wine? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Now, did you think they were stealing wine because they're kids? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. If your mom went to the kitchen, she could take a bottle of wine; is that right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: It was there for the guests? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. But you felt it was improper for them to do it because they were 12 years old and 13 years old; is that right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. ------- Simone said she was in the kitchen at around 1am when she saw the brothers enter. Zonen questioned whether the video game she was playing would have made a noise. She said it did but that she had not been playing the game at that moment. MR. ZONEN: You were sitting there watching them? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. Did you at any time tell them that you were there? SIMONE JACKSON: They saw me after. After they left they saw – MR. ZONEN: And why didn't you greet them as soon as they walked in the door? SIMONE JACKSON: I don't know. MR. ZONEN: Were you already angry at them? SIMONE JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: Okay. Did you tell anybody afterward? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. Who did you tell? SIMONE JACKSON: My mother. MR. ZONEN: All right. Did you tell Michael Jackson, your cousin? SIMONE JACKSON: No. Simone testified that she had often slept with Michael Jackson in his bed up until the age of eight or nine. She said that since then she has often slept in his bed but always with her brother. Zonen questioned her about her previous testimony where she stated the doors to the Neverland ranch house were always locked. She said she had to knock on the door before someone would let her inside. MR. ZONEN: So all the time that Janet Arvizo was there, the doors to the main house were locked; is that right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. And they were not opened at night and kept locked just during the day. They were locked all the time? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. Now, when you would go to knock on the door, who was it who would come to the door to let you in? SIMONE JACKSON: One of the chefs. MR. ZONEN: Were the chefs there 24 hours a day? SIMONE JACKSON: No. ------- MR. ZONEN: Would there be somebody standing by the door to let you in if you wanted to knock and come in late at night? SIMONE JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: So you would simply not be able to gain access to the main house at night if you were not already in there; is that right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Unless you got a security guard to let you in? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. On his redirect, defense attorney Thomas Mesereau asked whether she knew the Arvizo children had gotten their homework from school. She said neither the boys nor their mother had told her this. ------- MR. MESEREAU: All right. Was it your impression that Janet Arvizo could enter the main house when she wanted to? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Objection. Speculative and leading. THE COURT: Overruled. The answer is, "Yes." Next question. MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever see Janet Arvizo enter the main house? SIMONE JACKSON: No. MR. MESEREAU: You did see Gavin and Star in the main house from time to time, right? SIMONE JACKSON: Yes. MR. MESEREAU: And did you know whether or not they seemed to have pass codes to get into the house? MR. ZONEN: I'll object as leading. THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer. MR. MESEREAU: Did you know either way? SIMONE JACKSON: No. On re-cross examination by Zonen, Simone said she did not have a code to enter the house or into Jackson’s bedroom. The next witness to appear was Simone’s brother, Rijo Jackson, a soft-spoken 12-year old. Rijo said that he and his sister often went to Neverland and he had met Gavin and Star Arvizo in February 2003. He said the first time he saw them they were playing video games in the kitchen. MR. MESEREAU: And what did you used to do there with Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: We used to go on the rides, watch movies, go to the zoo, and play games, and that's all. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Now, do you remember staying at Neverland with Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: And where did you stay? RIJO JACKSON: In the unit. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Is that a guest unit? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And were you staying in the same room with Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. For one night I was. ------- MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Now, what did you see Gavin and Star do in the guest unit, Rijo? RIJO JACKSON: I saw them go to the T.V. and turn to a channel that had, like, naked girls on there, and doing other stuff, like nasty stuff. MR. MESEREAU: What nasty stuff? RIJO JACKSON: They were, like, jacking off and everything. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Did they do that in front of you? RIJO JACKSON: (Nods head up and down.) MR. MESEREAU: Was Michael Jackson anywhere near that room? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. What did you do when you saw Gavin and Star jacking off? RIJO JACKSON: I told my sister and she told me to go to Michael's room. MR. MESEREAU: And did you run to Michael's room when you saw that? RIJO JACKSON: (Nods head up and down.) MR. MESEREAU: Did Gavin and Star stay in the guest unit? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Did Gavin and Star say anything to you when they did the nasty stuff? RIJO JACKSON: The other day they did. They said, "Why don't you do that with me?" MR. MESEREAU: And what did you say to them? RIJO JACKSON: I said I didn't want to because it was nasty, and it's wrong. MR. MESEREAU: Now, when you ran to Michael's room, did you leave them in the guest unit? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Did you ever spend another night with Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: No. He also testified that he saw the Arvizo boys take a bottle of wine in Jackson’s bedroom. He said “I seen them take it upstairs and then that's all. And then, like, a few moments later I seen them run out the door.” MR. MESEREAU: And you saw them grab some of Michael's wine? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah, because he ordered some, and then they -- then the chef brought it in, and Star and Gavin said, "We'll take it upstairs for him." And so I seen them do that for -- like, ten minutes later they came downstairs and ran out the door. He said that Jackson was in the bathroom when the wine arrived and had not seen the boys take it. Rijo said he didn’t see the boys actually drinking the wine, as he had been downstairs in the bedroom at the time. He later testified that he also saw the boys looking through drawers in Neverland and that “they took some money, and, like, that was the chef's money and stuff.” MR. MESEREAU: Now, what money are you referring to? RIJO JACKSON: Like, in the kitchen there's all kinds of drawers. And then we seen them go in the -- Jesus' office after they went into the kitchen and seen them take some stuff. MR. MESEREAU: What stuff did you see them take? RIJO JACKSON: They had, like, little crystals. We seen them take crystals and money, and that was all they took. We seen them. MR. MESEREAU: Now, where did you see Gavin and Star take money? RIJO JACKSON: In Jesus' office. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And what did you see them do? Did they go into a drawer? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Were you watching them? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. RIJO JACKSON: I was in the kitchen. MR. MESEREAU: How do you know they took money? RIJO JACKSON: Because we seen them run out with it. ------- MR. MESEREAU: Now, you said something about chef's money. What did you mean? RIJO JACKSON: Like, his money that he -- that he worked for and everything. MR. MESEREAU: This was the chef? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Do you know what the chef's name was? RIJO JACKSON: I think it was Angel or Rudy. MR. MESEREAU: And where did you see them take Angel's money? RIJO JACKSON: Outside. ------- MR. MESEREAU: And, Rijo, how did you know it was Angel's money? RIJO JACKSON: Because the -- the cook, he doesn't really, like, keep his stuff -- he keeps his stuff in there, but that's all where he puts it. MR. MESEREAU: That's in a drawer? Rijo told the jurors that Jackson had once taken him to Toys-R-Us along with the Arvizo boys and some adult fans they picked up outside Neverland. MR. MESEREAU: And then did Michael take you back to Neverland? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And were these fans that Michael picked up and took with you to the store, were they girls? RIJO JACKSON: Boys and girls. MR. MESEREAU: Boys and girls. Okay. How many were there, do you think? RIJO JACKSON: I'm not sure. MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And if you remember, Rijo, what time of day was that when you went to Toys-R-Us? RIJO JACKSON: It was at night. Zonen opened his cross-examination by questioning Rijo about how often he went to Neverland and whether he ever missed school. Rijo said he could only remember one time that he missed school to go to Neverland. MR. ZONEN: During the time that you saw your cousin Michael, did you ever talk with him about Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: What? You're talking too fast. MR. ZONEN: I'm sorry. I'll slow down. (Laughter) MR. ZONEN: There's a court reporter here who would agree with you. At some time during February, did you see your cousin Michael? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. Did you talk with your cousin Michael during the month of February? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Did you talk with your cousin Michael about Gavin and Star during the month of February? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: Why not? RIJO JACKSON: Because we didn't -- because we didn't have nothing to say about them. MR. ZONEN: Does that mean that nothing happened in the month of February with Gavin and Star? RIJO JACKSON: No, it did, but, like, we didn't talk about them. MR. ZONEN: Well, weren't you concerned about their behavior? RIJO JACKSON: Not really. MR. ZONEN: You weren't concerned about it? RIJO JACKSON: I was, but I tried to tell -- I forgot about it. Rijo said he did not tell Jackson about what he had witnessed the Arvizo boys doing in the guest unit because “I was scared”. He said the pornography was on television and not a video or DVD. MR. ZONEN: And then you said they were jerking off; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Do you know what that means? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah, like putting your hand, like, on your private and then just moving it. MR. ZONEN: And were they both standing at the time? RIJO JACKSON: They were in bed. MR. ZONEN: They were in bed. And they were covered with blankets? RIJO JACKSON: (Nods head up and down.) MR. ZONEN: You could tell what they were doing? RIJO JACKSON: (Nods head up and down.) MR. ZONEN: Were they in separate beds? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. He said that after witnessing the boys masturbating, he told his sister, who told him to go to Jackson’s room. Zonen pointed out that in an interview with an investigator he had said that his sister told him to "Go back to your room". RIJO JACKSON: Yes -- no, first I went to my sister's room and then I went back to my room, and then I went to Michael's room. MR. ZONEN: Now, when you went to Michael's room, I think you said Michael was there at that time? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. And you told Michael what had happened in the bedroom; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: I told him a little bit. And then he left to the bathroom. MR. ZONEN: And he left for the bathroom? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. ZONEN: When you told him a little bit, did you tell him -- among the little bit that you told him, did you tell him that they watched something bad on television? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: And you told him that they watched something that had naked women -- RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: -- on television? RIJO JACKSON: And then -- yes. MR. ZONEN: And did it also have naked men? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: Just naked women? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. What did Michael say to you when you told him that they were watching something with naked women on television? RIJO JACKSON: He didn't believe it. MR. ZONEN: He didn't believe it? RIJO JACKSON: Because, like, he thought -- he thought they were cool, and he didn't think they would do that. MR. ZONEN: I'm sorry, I can't hear you. Say it again. RIJO JACKSON: He thought they were good, and they wouldn't do that. MR. ZONEN: Did you tell him about what they were doing inside the bed? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: You didn't tell him that? How come you didn't tell him that? RIJO JACKSON: Because I didn't want to, like, tell him, because I was scared. MR. ZONEN: Did you spend that night in bed with your cousin Michael? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. Did you do that often, share a bed with your cousin Michael? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. Zonen turned the questions to the incident with the wine in Jackson’s room. Rijo clarified: “He was upstairs, and then he ordered it, because I could hear him upstairs, and then he went to the bathroom, and he told the cook that -- to bring it upstairs, but Gavin and Star answered the door.” MR. ZONEN: Okay. And he ordered it while you were there, and while Gavin was there, and while Star was there? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Okay. And you expected that he would bring -- that they would bring wine to the room while you were there; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. ------- MR. ZONEN: So you're telling us that as soon as they delivered it, Gavin and Star grabbed the wine and left? RIJO JACKSON: They grabbed the wine from the door, and then they took it upstairs, and then like a few minutes later, I don't know how many, but they came downstairs and ran out the door. MR. ZONEN: So they took the wine? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: And they went upstairs? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: And upstairs is where your cousin Michael's bed is; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. So they were upstairs with your cousin Michael and with the wine? RIJO JACKSON: No, Michael was downstairs. MR. ZONEN: All right. Michael was downstairs when the wine was delivered? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: So Michael saw that the wine was delivered? RIJO JACKSON: No. He was in the bathroom. MR. ZONEN: He was in the bathroom when the wine was delivered? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: All right. So they took the wine upstairs to the bedroom; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. Rijo testified that Angel Vivanco delivered the wine bottle and one glass. He said Vivanco left the bottle downstairs and the Arvizo brothers took it upstairs. He said the bottle of white wine was still unopened when it was delivered. Rijo stayed in the room when the boys left and Jackson then returned from the bathroom. When they arrived upstairs, he testified, the bottle was open. MR. ZONEN: So they took the bottle of wine, they opened it and they had a drink; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: I -- I'm not sure if they drank it or not. MR. ZONEN: Well, some was missing, right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: So they either drank it or they poured it out; is that right? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Now, did you talk with Michael about that? RIJO JACKSON: No, because I wasn't sure that they drank it or not. Because -- MR. ZONEN: You weren't sure that they drank it? RIJO JACKSON: Yes. MR. ZONEN: Well, was anybody else up there? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: Did Michael seem upset that there was some wine missing from the bottle? RIJO JACKSON: No. MR. ZONEN: Did he ask you about why wine was missing from the bottle? RIJO JACKSON: No. ------- MR. ZONEN: Okay. Did your cousin Michael seem upset about that, that it was opened? RIJO JACKSON: (Shakes head from side to side.) MR. ZONEN: He thought it was okay? RIJO JACKSON: Yeah. MR. ZONEN: And – RIJO JACKSON: Because he might have thought that the cook opened it for him. Another Jackson family member, Michelle Jackson, took to the stand next. She is Jackson’s aunt and grandmother to both Rijo and Simone. She testified briefly about a conversation she had with Jackson’s accuser. MR. MESEREAU: Who told you about a trip? MICHELLE JACKSON: Simone. MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever talk to Gavin about this trip? MICHELLE JACKSON: Yes. . MR. MESEREAU: What did Gavin say? MR. ZONEN: Objection; hearsay. THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer. MICHELLE JACKSON: Gavin told me, "We don't want to go to Brazil. This is my mother who wants to go. We want to stay here." MR. ZONEN: I'm going to object as to multiple hearsay. THE COURT: Sustained. MR. ZONEN: Motion to strike. THE COURT: I'll strike the last sentence. MR. MESEREAU: Did Gavin tell you why they were planning to go to Brazil? MICHELLE JACKSON: He told me his mother wanted to go. MR. ZONEN: Objection. Move to strike; hearsay. THE COURT: Stricken. During his cross-examination, Zonen spent much time establishing why she and her grandchildren were often at Neverland. She testified that the children sometimes lived with her and that she stopped at Neverland after work to see if the children needed to be driven to baseball practice. MR. ZONEN: Okay. When Gavin talked about a trip to Brazil, did you understand that that was going to be your cousin Michael Jackson sending them to Brazil? MICHELLE JACKSON: I didn't even question. It didn't even dawn on me to ask the question how they were going. MR. ZONEN: Did you ever have a conversation with Michael Jackson about the family? MICHELLE JACKSON: No. Wednesday’s final witness was Jackson videographer Christian Robinson. Defense attorney Robert Sanger spent much time establishing Robinson’s credentials and work history. Robinson said he did a lot of work on reality TV and had worked on Jackson’s “What More Can I Give” project. He first worked with the singer in September 2001 but said he doesn’t know him well. MR. SANGER: Now, what was Mr. Schaffel's role in this, as far as you could tell? MR. ROBINSON: He was like the per -- he was the person who was orchestrating the whole thing, you know, besides Michael. Michael wasn't always on scene, so Marc was arranging the artists and the times and the places, and, you know, getting the most important things done, you know. MR. SANGER: Now, when you say "Michael," we have to use last names in court so.... MR. ROBINSON: Oh. Mr. Jackson, yeah. MR. SANGER: Mr. Jackson, or Michael Jackson was the person who was there during some of the creative process; is that correct? MR. ROBINSON: Right. Michael would come into the studio occasionally and produce, which is, you know, obviously one of his fortes, so -- MR. SANGER: So he would, on occasion, be there when the artists were actually recording? MR. ROBINSON: Not all the time, but, yes. MR. SANGER: Okay. And he'd sit at one those big things that has all those switches on it? MR. ROBINSON: Right, it's called a board. Robinson said he had been involved with Debbie Rowe’s interview for the “Take 2” rebuttal video. Rowe is Jackson’s ex-wife. He said he was initially meant to ask her the questions but that Ian Drew ended up with this role, while he filmed part of the interview. MR. ROBINSON: The raw tape was probably between one hour and an hour and a half, I would guess. MR. SANGER: Okay. That was the part you did? MR. ROBINSON: Well, there was two cameras, but, yes. Yes. MR. SANGER: Okay. Now, on that occasion, do you know whether or not there was a script? Was there a script? MR. ROBINSON: No, sir. MR. SANGER: Okay. And you know what a script is; is that correct? MR. ROBINSON: Yes. MR. SANGER: Okay. Were there questions that were written out in advance? MR. ROBINSON: Of course. MR. SANGER: And you wrote some of those questions; is that correct? MR. ROBINSON: Right. ------- MR. SANGER: Okay. Now, as an interviewer for something like this, where you're interviewing Celine Dion for "What More Can I Give?" or you're interviewing Debbie Rowe, would it be customary for the person asking the questions to have a list of questions to ask? MR. ROBINSON: Yes. MR. SANGER: Okay. You smiled a bit. Would it be unusual for somebody to just walk in there and try to wing it without a list of questions? MR. ROBINSON: Yeah, that would not be proper. Before the court recessed for the day, Robinson said that Rowe’s answered were not scripted. His testimony was due to continue Thursday. *disclaimer: This is testimony transcribed from notes from within the courtroom. They have been compared to the official transcripts for accuracy.