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发表于 2009-10-7 05:30:46
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本帖最后由 lovelymj 于 2009-10-10 07:11 编辑
第12节：Religion and finding God in Rituals 宗教及在仪式中发现神
翻译: gummykitty
SB:I always say that the main purpose of religion is to teach you in your twenties what you only find out in your seventies-skip You know all that at eighty, but you should know it in your teens and twenties, so you don't squander your life.
没有宗教，某些道理人们要到七八十岁了才能自行悟出。所以我总说宗教的主要目的是趁人们还很年轻时就把这些道理教给他们，好叫他们不要虚度光阴。
MJ:Right, I see it, I see it. That's what we're all talking about.
是的，我懂得这点。这是我们一直在谈论的。
SB: You're one of the few people who seems to be religious without practicing, meaning, you have a very deep-seated sense of spirituality, but you don't undertake many religious rituals. You'll tell me things like, "Although I once believed God is in a Church, I now believe that God is everywhere, he's in my heart...I now find God in those moments I spend with my children, I find God in the innocent."
你属于极少数在世俗生活中也能保持虔诚的人。即便不太参加宗教仪式，你仍然能做很深层的灵修。你跟我说“尽管我一度相信神存在于教会中，现在我相信神无处不在，他就在我心中… 我在和我孩子共同度过的时光中发现神，我在纯真无邪的人身上看到神。”
MJ: Yeah it's true, it's true.
没错，是这样的。
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第13节：KARMA AND JUSTICE 因果报应和公正
翻译: gummykitty
SB: I really like the fact that at Neverland the Security are called Safety...it's on their badges, uniforms and hats.
Neverland的警卫叫做“安全员”，我喜欢这个名称。他们的胸卡、制服和帽子上都有“安全员”的字样。
MJ:I don't know.
我没注意过这个。
SB:The fact that it says "Safety" rather than "Security" it's like, "We are not here to keep the world out, but simply to ensure the safety of everyone who is visiting here." It's less intimidating and more humane.
Rabbi talks about the sense of justice in children-skip- On one hand children have this very strong sense of justice, and on the other hand we see how mean people get away with things and no one stops them.
不叫他们“警卫”而是“安全员”意味着他们不是要把整个世界挡在门外，而仅仅要保证每个到访宾客的安全。这听起来少了威胁性，多了份人情味。
（SB接下去谈论儿童的正义感，具体文字省略。大意为：一方面孩子有着非常强的正义感，另一方面我们也看到恶人如何逃脱制裁。）
MJ: It happens all the time. I think justice is important because there are many injustices in the world and I hate injustice. "I am tired of injustice" is the opening to one of my songs on my last album, called Scream. That's the first line I say. There's a line where Janet says, "Oh my God I can't believe what I saw on the TV this evening. I was disgusted by all the injustice," because I wanted people to know about that and people get away with it and I don't believe in karma. I think that is bunch of crap, because so many mean-spirited, evil people are on top of the world and doing well and people love them, no matter how evil they are.
这司空见惯。我认为正义非常重要，这世上有太多的不公，而我痛恨不公。我上一张专辑里有一首歌叫《尖叫》（Scream），开头第一句就是“我厌倦了不公”。那歌里还有一句Janet的唱词是“哦，我的上帝，我无法相信今夜在电视上的所见。我对一切不公感到恶心”。我写这些歌词是因为我想让人们意识到非正义的存在。我不信因果报应，那纯粹是胡说。那么多恶人功成名就，作威作福，而大众竟然还热爱他们。
SB: I love it when you make strong statements like that.
我喜欢你的强烈论点。
MJ: Well, I'm sorry, it's crap. Karma is a theory like any other theory that some human made up.
抱歉我的过激用词。因果报应就是别有居心的人捏造出来的。
SB:Well, "what goes around comes around" is ok, because there's great truth to that. But karma could actually be evil because karma says that handicapped children did something bad in previous life.
“不是不报，时候未到”这话也许有点道理，可因果报应论可能真的很邪恶，因为照这种说法有些孩子生来残疾是因为他们在前世做恶。
MJ:That's a fine line and I'm sorry for talking like that. But I hate whoever says some thing like that. A child did something in a past life so God is going to handicap them? There were all these orphans in this one country coming to America to be adopted. The plane crashed. Every child on the plane died. Why? If you could save those kids, if you were in Heaven, you would say, "This one is not going down. Maybe another one, but not this one." I know I would.
这两者间有着细微的差别，而我痛恨因果报应的说法。神因为一个孩子前世的行为而要他在今世残疾？某国的一群孤儿被领养，在飞往美国的途中飞机坠毁了，所有的孩子都死了。为什么会这样？如果你是神，你肯定会救那些孩子，你会说“不要让这架飞机坠毁”。我绝不忍心让那些孤儿死去。
SB: Did you ever have Eastern spiritual gurus who came to you and said, "Michael children get hit by trucks because they fornicated in a previous life?"
有没有东方的精神导师对你说“Michael, 有的孩子被卡车撞是因为他们上辈子私通”？
MJ:No, and if they did I would be furious and I would give them all the reasons why that is a bunch of crap. That's a doodoo. That's a theory like any other man's theory about the universe. Some people believe in the Big Bang, which I don't, and some people believe in the Creation, that story with Adam and Eve, that this universe isn't an accident. To say this universe was created by a Big Bang or an accident is to say, "Okay, I want you to take a car engine and we are going to take each piece apart and we are going to put it in a bath tub, and I want you to shake it up." You can shake that tub 100 years and it will never become the perfect engine. All the pieces come together and make an engine, that is like saying the Big Bang theory, and there was a big explosion and we got children and trees, and plants, and the air we breath, and oxygen. Somebody had to create this, a designer had to create this. From our lashes to our mouths to our digestive system. Don't you agree?
没有。如果他们那样说我会感到愤怒，我会努力驳斥。就好象其他的人类宇宙观，有人相信宇宙诞生于大爆炸理论，而我不信那个。我相信神创造万物，相信亚当夏娃，相信这个宇宙不是随机产生的。大爆炸理论就好比说把一台汽车引擎拆开，把所有零件放到澡盆里不断晃动。就算你摇上一百年，那些零件也不可能随机的就拼成原来的引擎。同样道理，孩子们、大树、植物，还有我们呼吸的空气，都不会是从大爆炸中随机产生的。从我们的睫毛到消化系统，太多神奇的东西，肯定有人设计并且创造了所以这些。你同意吗？
SB: That's the most important of all religions beliefs, that God is the origin of life.
神即生命之源，这是所有宗教信仰中最重要的。
MJ:When I used to go door to door [Witnessing for the Jehovah's Witnesses Church] and people would say, "We are atheists," [I'd think] what? They don't believe in....I heard it a lot and I had a brother who was an atheist for a while but I think he isn't now. Tito was an atheist even after being raised as a strict Jehovah's Witness. I know some of the famous directors, the guy who directed Singing In The Rain and who won academy awards, Stanley Donen....
过去我挨家挨户做耶和华见证者传道的时候，有人会说他们是无神论者，我就会想不通他们为何没有信仰。。。那话我听得太多了，我哥哥Tito也曾那样，要知道我们可是从小就接受严格耶和华见证者训导的。我知道有些著名导演，比如拍《雨中曲》的Stanley Donen...（没说完，估计说Donen也是无神论者。）
SB: So what arguments did you have for people when you were Pioneering when they told you that they were atheists?
碰上这样宣称自己是无神论者的人，你摆出哪些论据呢？
MJ: I tried to bring out the miracles of life, the children, look into their eyes, our bodies, how it all works just right, this can't happen on its own, come on, no way. Then there are the questions I have about why we are here and why we are allowed to destroy each other. Because we are the only species who destroys their own. Every species on this planet...I don't understand how all that injustice takes place. Why didn't something in heaven stop the Holocaust or some of the great genocides that happen in the world, from the lynchings and slavery, to all the great problems, to Stalin, to...? I hate to say this but Napoleon, too. He gets praised for all his genocide [I assume Michael means all the wars he caused], whereas Hitler gets called the Devil, which he was. But they both did the same thing. But one was doing it for his country and the other one was too! But a lot of people died with Napoleon. There are statues of Napoleon.
我列举了生命中的奇迹。比如说孩子，仔细看他们的眼睛；又比如说我们的身体，各个组成部分协同工作准确无误。这些都不可能是偶然形成的，不可能。我还会想人类为何成为现在的样子，为什么自相残杀。地球上所有的物种里，大概只有人类如此互相杀戮。我对所有那些不公感到难以理解。为什么上天不曾阻止二战大屠杀和历史上其他的种族灭绝，还有奴隶制和私刑等等。很遗憾拿破仑也有问题。人们称颂他，而他发动了那么多战争使无数人死亡，这和被叫做魔鬼的希特勒也没什么两样，都是假国家之名。不同的是人们追随拿破仑，还给他立像。
SB talks about that-no one was ever as evil as Hitler - and then talks about Napoleon.
SB谈到希特勒，说他的邪恶无人能及。接着又说拿破仑。
MJ: But he [Napoleon] died a lonely man on an island all alone.
可是拿破仑被流放，在岛上孤独死去。
SB: Do you enjoy reading about history?
你喜欢读历史书？
MJ: I do enjoy reading about history, but I don't know what to believe and what not to believe. Because I know how much that is written about me is twisted...about me....how much stuff in history is twisted. Because the way this country was taken away from the Indians and the way Australia was taken from the black and apartheid, how they killed so many blacks.
是的，但我对哪些可以相信哪些是谎言感到困惑。因为我知道有多少关于我自己的歪曲报道，那历史书里又有多少是谎言和欺骗呢。要知道美国这个国家是从印第安人手里夺过来的，澳大利亚也是白人从原著民那里抢来的，他们杀了多少黑人呐。 |
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